Introduction of a new species to Control another

[cloudsitter]

Earlier today, and last night I was observing my plants and came to the realization that my plants have been filling in a niche that doesn't exist here because it wasn't originally needed, I believe that Rainforest had also mentioned something similar here on his niche of the forum. My observation being that particular species/hybrids tend to prey on certain species of prey, which here that diversity is ever increasing along the terms of small vertebrates and invertebrates that are being introduced on purpose or not. We can't control everything that comes in on the boats, planes etc. why don't we consider the introduction of hybrids or species of Nepenthes to Hawaii which in turn would put a control on small pests and give nepenthes another safe haven for them to continue after all the plants being introduced would come from cultivation.

ex. of Nepenthes and prey:
N. sibuyanensis x truncata has been feeding on primarily small to large cockroaches, geckos, Cuban anoles young, small moths, ants (multiple species),and other small gnats/flying insects.

N. Rokko has been feeding on small flying insects, moderate Cuban anoles (hatchlings up to 4"-5" inches without tail), and loads of ants.

I will be starting a tally on prey from a select few plants that will have to fend for themselves without fertilizing, to get a better look of what they are eating and amounts of what they are eating.

I'd like to here others thoughts on the matter, should or shouldn't why to or why not.

[rsivertsen]

VERY touchy subject! Two wrongs do NOT make a right, and all that conservationism rhetoric.

Yet we live in this life called "Planet Reality"! West Nile disease is NOT indigenous to the northeast coast of the USA, but the fact is that it's here! What do we do as intelligent creatures? Hmm, food for thought! ... I'm developing an Aldrovanda farm in efforts to see if they can provide a natural and effective control and balance against those parasites that occupy shallow dystrophic pools where no other natural predator could occupy, and go into decline when its food source (mosquito larvae) also go into decline without presenting a threat to the populations of indigenous species of plants or animals.

There's NO shortage of well intentioned efforts to control one species with another that resulted in an environmental disaster. Florida and Hawaii may top the lists of those examples!

- Rich

[obregon562]

This is a great idea! touchy like Rich said though...I think nepenthes would be great in that role, but their slow growing as youngsters may be a set back...we would have to make sure that neps dont become weeds however...hmmm! I'll be keeping my eye on this topic!

[jefforever]

I think you should try it in your back yard first, and see how things go.

For example, I saw a significant drop in the wasp population around my house after several years with an established sarracenia bog.

[cloudsitter]

Oh, no, I wasn't going to to jump the gun but the idea occured so I thought I'd present it here since this is the best place I could think of to present it. And yes the backyard theory was the first place (second to a more confined testing area) but the backyard is so far the first trial grounds. Mainly in seeing what prey is being caught in comparison to what is here.

I'd still love to hear more and as soon as I've got something more factual I'll post it until then I'll be answering where I can and asking where I can't.

Thanks,

Rob

[burkei]

<< For example, I saw a significant drop in the wasp population around my house after several years with an established sarracenia bog. >>

True, but you could also see an increase in the ant population now drawn to the area looking to feed on Nepenthes nectar.

[rsivertsen]

In geologic terms, our lifespan is a rather brief one! Imagine a few hundred or thousand years, when some species of Nepenthes has gone feral in some part of Hawaii, and caused another small creature to go extinct in that time; perhaps some insect that was a vital pollinator for another species of plant. The complexities of the interconnecting fabric of nature are often very subtle, pull out the wrong string, and a large part of the entire fabric may unravel.

- Rich

[unclemasa]

For all practical purposes this sort of thing is, as rsivertsen says, very tricky and problematic. Many times when this has been done it has resulted in disaster, or at least disaster from the perspective of our interests.

The question gets very interesting philosophically. For example, were not all the Hawaiian species "invaders" at one time? We have learned the importance of maintaining a diverse biota and want to avoid ecological disasters that diminish diversity ( ... working against our long term interests) but valuation of one plant or animal above another is, ignoring religious arguments for the moment, always a matter of self-interest.

I did, for a while, consider introducing tigers onto my neighbor's property. ;D

[cloudsitter]

Thanks Sam I do see the down falls and that's one of the reasons I want to go further with this in a safe manner and see what native species are being caught if many and the "invaders" that are being caught.

[jefforever]

How bout you fence them in a 10 x 10 ft enclosure somewhere in your yard?

They won't escape then?

[unclemasa]

The reckless introduction of alien species into a fragile environment is crazy.

Growing your Nepenthes in a cage ..... is crazier still. ;D

[phissionkorps]

For example, were not all the Hawaiian species "invaders" at one time?

I don't know if I'd go that far...obviously not every species invaded. The first things to colonize an island are spiders, so when they landed, they weren't invading an ecosystem that didn't exist. When the first plants arrived (probably through seeds carried in bird excrement), they didn't really invade per se either, since there were no other established plants ATM. Then we can go further and say when other plants arrived, if they didn't use the same resources/space as the current established species, they didn't really invade either. As Rich said, touchy subject

[jefforever]

Jun 4, 2008 18:25:24 GMT -10 unclemasa said:

The reckless introduction of alien species into a fragile environment is crazy.

Growing your Nepenthes in a cage ..... is crazier still. ;D

Yeah... lol! I'm not advocating for letting them affect the environment, but maybe a small area could be tested.

That way it could be controlled easier.

(It's hard to imagine this in Oregon!)