Ebayer to avoid

[tonyp]

Hi All,

I just thought I would point out that Dom Gravine in the guise of his buddies addresses, and ebay and email accounts has been auctioning off alot of plants on Ebay lately. First under the name Orchidstar87 and now Borneancanableo6. Mostly he has been listing items recently received from Austrailia through a US importer. But there have also been a few items which both Sunbelle and myself have reported as plants stolen last year.

N. trusmadiensis
N. truncata x veitchii
As well as others!

You will also find it interesting to note that in a number of previous auctions he has bid on his own auctions to bump up the price. And in a few cases accidently won them and had no buyer so was forced to relist them and try again.

I would suggest you avoid this person and any dealings with him. Don't support his efforts to turn a profit.

Tony

[Noa_F]

Wow, I just bought a few plants from him from ebay including

N. thorellii x trusmadiensis
N. sibuyanesis x talangensis
N. spec. x Aristo

Thanks for warning me and I dont plan to do buisness with him again.

[sdcarnivores]

What did he do that garners him the warning status?

[phissionkorps]

What did he do that garners him the warning status?

I didn't think it'd be THAT hard to read the OP, but ok, I'll play.

Mostly he has been listing items recently received from Austrailia through a US importer. But there have also been a few items which both Sunbelle and myself have reported as plants stolen last year.

N. trusmadiensis
N. truncata x veitchii
As well as others!

You will also find it interesting to note that in a number of previous auctions he has bid on his own auctions to bump up the price. And in a few cases accidently won them and had no buyer so was forced to relist them and try again.

[sdcarnivores]

I asked because from what little I used to read of the situation online, it didn't seem like anyone had proven with sound evidence that dom had stolen anything. And weren't all of the trusmadiensis recently put on ebay the new tc clones from BE? I don't see how that makes him a suspect. I know the carnivorous plant community is quick to hang people like witches, so I'm often weary about these issues...

[rainforest]

I am also of the belief that everyone is innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. Until then it's all hearsay and prejudice.
There's so many people out there that have done wrongs but we tend to turn our heads in other directions and make some issues more important than others. We still see these crooks on Ebay selling plants yet we do not put out notices banning them from the same kind of activities going on.
Tony and Sunbelle both have lost special plants, yet authorities have not cracked down on any actual criminal prosecution. It must also be the responsibilities of the growers to safeguard their plants with surveillance cameras, DVR recording devices and alarms and ways to prevent theft. In Hawai'i it was made into law that farm theft be treated as a strict criminal offense and well above simple burglaries and stealing. Proof of theft can quickly lead to intense law enforcement agencies to arrest and speedy indictments/jail time. Farm theft is not just a simple helping oneself of pots, plants and equipment with no recourse.
If these individuals are still selling then it must be ok for them to do it. Otherwise Ebay would be preventing them from doing so and selling "hot" items would be a definite no-no for Ebay's reputation.

M

[jgriffin]

They did stop him once-hence the name change.

[michelle]

Apr 14, 2009 10:22:40 GMT -10 rainforest said:

I am also of the belief that everyone is innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. Until then it's all hearsay and prejudice.
There's so many people out there that have done wrongs but we tend to turn our heads in other directions and make some issues more important than others. We still see these crooks on Ebay selling plants yet we do not put out notices banning them from the same kind of activities going on.
Tony and Sunbelle both have lost special plants, yet authorities have not cracked down on any actual criminal prosecution. It must also be the responsibilities of the growers to safeguard their plants with surveillance cameras, DVR recording devices and alarms and ways to prevent theft. In Hawai'i it was made into law that farm theft be treated as a strict criminal offense and well above simple burglaries and stealing. Proof of theft can quickly lead to intense law enforcement agencies to arrest and speedy indictments/jail time. Farm theft is not just a simple helping oneself of pots, plants and equipment with no recourse.
If these individuals are still selling then it must be ok for them to do it. Otherwise Ebay would be preventing them from doing so and selling "hot" items would be a definite no-no for Ebay's reputation.

M

Michael,
You know nothing about the situation.
Nothing.
Your post is so off target I don't know where to start to correct you. Parts of your post are so wrong, it's almost funny. Please do not spread misinformation about our situation. It is not helping at all.

If you think Dom is totally innocent, why don't you invite him and Jerry to visit your place to see your Nepenthes collection?


For everyone else who wants to know what really happened to both us and Tony, don't worry, the full story will come out eventually. We are not going to explain everything until this matter is closed. The investigation is still being conducted. Since Dom is reading these forums, it would not be wise to give him the advantage of knowing what we know.

Thanks,
Michelle

[rainforest]

Michelle,
First of all, you don't CONTRIBUTE any ideas, nep sharing or anything on this forum. You post bad-shit, PMS-ism and harp on everyone. If everyone reads all of your posts here, one can come to the conclusion that you're best at bitching and NOTHING else. So PLEASE before you and anyone else want to make a meaningful statement on anything, I suggest you post positive and noteworthy comments before just advertising your hate and dissent. This forum is about posting ideas and cultivation tips and sharing ideas. Keep your bad propaganda out of this site UNLESS you have facts, you can post proof, you can truly show without the shadow of a doubt that someone has done you wrong. Until that time, everyone is entitled to their opinion and how dare you say anything to the contrary. It appears to me that you want everyone ELSE here to do your bidding. I have had instances where I have been ripped off, sure. But did you hear me posting it on the forums? Nada. Did you hear how this person stole a bunch of macrophylla's, Trusmadiensis', rajah's,lowii's and all the plants growing in my cold chambers? Nope. BECAUSE it doesn't help to bring this to the fore. But what I did do is handle it in a way that I got results. I worked with all the agencies that will prosecute this individual and paid top lawyers, and worked with various law enforcement to catch this thief. It also helped that this person also stole from bonsai collectors, orchid, bromeliad and cacti-succulent collectors as well, and I formed this network to capture this plant thief. So PULLLEEEZZZEEE do not lecture me on this subject. I do not have visitors (unlike others who loves to show off), my property has hidden and visually evident cameras that I can access by my iPhone or work computer at any time. The system cost me under a thousand and it's peace of mind.
Michelle, do you have peace of mind? If all you're about is ranting and raving without peace of mind, then I think you should wake up and get some.
This is a shame how the "other" forums have turned into a witch hunt and condemn individuals based on HATE. HATE is actions of remorse without thorough understanding and compassion.
So until you have PROOF please don't advertise your HATE.

M

[sockhom]

Man, it's hard to be a moderator these days... Are you guys doing a competition on the various forums? ;D

OK, go on if you will but don't you use names . Do not waste time with a well constructed discussion; sarcasm and ad hominem arguments are so much funnier .
Just kidding ;D.

François.

[rainforest]

Francois,
I don't envy your job as mod, here. But I am very sick and tired of people (who never post in a positive way) and when you post a different (against the status quo) post, these very people get upset that you're going against the "grain."

This is the reason why I will never post in Tropical Pitcher Plant Forums or any other forums. Their way of thinking is just one way. They didn't like it when I discussed the finer points of fertilizing, they didn't like it when I said anything negative about tissue culture and they also didn't like anything I had to say about the status quo.

Funny how that the majority of people do fertilize today, feel that seed-originals are the BEST plants to collect, that the status quo isn't the final word and that small basement hobbyists are just as important than the large growers. I like this forum.

Just because you think differently, doesn't make you a bad person. We'd all be witches burned at the stake if we were to just believe one thing.

M

[rsivertsen]

Being a mod is a thankless job at best. It amazes me how hostile some people can be on the internet, and not just CP forums either; I'm on a few other forums from chess to other interests, and it seems to me that some people can be rather rude at times, with accusations and other forms of attacks that they might not make during face to face encounters; and mods are not all above this either. I left one site because the mod insisted that I reveal the content and sender of a personal email I got, which was in no way any threat to anyone! - And even threatened to ban me from his site if I refused! Amazing!

I also fertilize my plants, with great results, also feed them insect matter, and have NO problems expressing my opinions here, and elsewhere, and have also faced some stiff criticisms and even attacks, here and elsewhere, but blow it off as just immature responses from those who are less secure in their position on the subject, and let it go. Most times, people only disgrace themselves in these silly attacks anyway. Sometimes we just have to agree to disagree, and move on. Peace! ... and that's my two cents worth for today.

- Rich

[sdcarnivores]

I remember getting shot down when i suggested one person COULD be a suspect in Tony's plant thefts, because that person had cheated me out of several hundred dollars and mysteriously disappeared. It was also something that I didn't go spreading around the forums because it's my business, but I brought it to some light because anyone with such a history should have their actions noted to the public so others can judge for themselves. A fair portion of the outspoken veterans here have been the object of public criticism at one point or another. I've seen enough of it to know that much of it tends to be childish BS with little/no truth to it whatsoever.

[darenc]

WOW,
i would like to thank Tony for the heads up. I was gonna say something a few weeks back after seeing some pretty rare thing's ,but wasnt too sure if it was who i thought it was until i seen the a name on their feedback an also noticed that with all the plant's this indaviduial was selling it tooks almost a moth for anyone to post feedback an when they did OMG ..... who was it ....... Snafu an we all know that name as well as other names .
Then spoke to a Friend from another forum (Pitcher-Plant), an mentioned this to him an he told me he had already been notified about this .
So again thank you for the heads up an please keep us informed

Daren Cadue

[Dave Evans]

Hey Michael,

I think you must have Michelle beat, like 40 to 1, in the number of rants posted in various forums. Is the pot calling the kettle black?