Many plants, coming from Indochina (Thailand, Vietnam, Cambodia and Lao) are sold as N. thorelii.
The true N. thorelii is not in cultivation.
You either grow N. smilesii (formerly N. anamensis), N. kampotiana, N. bokorensis or some undescribed species, or even hybrids between all these similar species.
They are more or less all species with linear-lanceolate leaves with clasping base and reddish pitchers.
If you want to have an ID (or, at least, a surmise of ID), INSIST on asking the location of your plant.
I will ask all of you to continue this discussion in private (by PM). It is of no interest for the users here to read those kind of posts, so I will erase the following ones if you keep on fighting.
I will be in Vietnam in less than three months; I hope some of you can help. If you can't or don't want, well I will come nonetheless . My flights are booked.
Truly,
François.
PS: Oh and I didn't write the Wikipedia thorelii article, it is a guy from UK (most of the article). He did a fine job .
Last Edit: Nov 30, 2009 6:15:27 GMT -10 by sockhom
"When I am king you will be first against the wall..."
This is a great discovery. It's like rediscovering N. deaniana.
I'm convinced the plant in the 5 first pictures is the true N. thorelii which had not been seen in the wild since its description in 1909. I will go to Vietnam in february to make things sure and will collect herbarium samples and write a scientific paper and... a field report!
Wish me good luck!
François.
Last Edit: Nov 20, 2009 23:05:07 GMT -10 by sockhom
"When I am king you will be first against the wall..."
François, that's TRANG, not Trat ) Trat is the home of N. kampotiana! The rest is correct. And the post of floranepenthaceae is fine. I would add that in Pangà you have not just N. Viking (rare) and N. "thorelii-like", but even N. mirabilis! The plants sold by Thai growers are mostly N. thorelii-like x mirabilis. A part from Nong, I had the opportunity to realize that those colonies are well known by the Thai nurseries/poachers, but they of course have no idea of what species/hybrids/varieties they are. So as long as you buy plants called "tiger" and "thorelii", you'll get a bit of everything (mostly hybrids).
Dave, if Nong crossed a Viking with the "Cambodia tiger" (yes, that's kampotiana), then yes, it's a homemade hybrid, so it's viking x kampotiana. Viking is an extreme form of mirabilis, so it will show - on both the plants of Pangà and Trang - the fimbriate margins with much variability, like the normal mirabilis. Who said the viking from Trang doesn't have fimbriate margins? The plants from Trang and from Pangà are basically the same, except maybe for the colour, which is a bit darker in Trang.
"When I am king you will be first against the wall..."
There are "Vikings" on the island of Phang Ga and on the mainland (in Trat). Marcello considered both populations to be "Vikings" with just very slight differences.
On the Island of Phang Ga (where "Vikings have been first collected), there are "sp. Viking", an undescribed species and hybrids between the two of them.
Nong went to that island and collected a bit of everything.
The problem is that in his latest book, Stewart McPherson refers to the Viking taxon as "N. sp. Phanga" whereas Marcello uses the same name to refer to the undescribed species (thorelii like) from the same island!
I'll let Marcello chime in...
Cello, if you want and have the time, you can copy the post on Flora Nepenthaceae, edit it, and post it here. Or do whatever suits you best.
Lastly, Mark I agree with you about taxonomy. We're just trying to put some order some chaos, that's all. It's useless but it's useful. ;D
François.
"When I am king you will be first against the wall..."
Unfortunately, I didn't find any viable seeds. The pods were either still green or too old. That's a shame. I hope to return to the location next year. I might be lucky that time.
One more pic... N. spec. Pursat in habitat. A very steep slope:
Cheers,
François.
"When I am king you will be first against the wall..."
Of course I share your enthusiasm and your ideas but how do you decide that a land is good for the a secundary colony? Of course, you will check that the ecology will be similar but is there a faint chance that the introduction of a Nepenthes species can be detrimental to another species of (non carnivorous) plant/organism? I know this is a cliché but still, I wonder...
François.
"When I am king you will be first against the wall..."